00:01

Welcome to Episode 2 of Season 12 of the Growing Empire Show. Today I'm here with my special guest Andrew Schutsky from Redline Equity and we're going to talk about how to use syndicated deals as a method to grow your passive investment portfolio. So stay tuned.

00:18

Welcome to Growing Empires. Hosted by real estate entrepreneur and trusted investment advisor, Jennifer de Jesus. Growing Empires provides insight to building wealth through passive income producing real estate investments for those who want to build and manage a more profitable real estate portfolio.

00:37

So welcome, Andrew to the Growing Empire Show. I'm so glad that you're here.

00:42

Thanks so much for having me on. Number one. I love the name of the show. So kudos to that as well.

00:46

Oh, thanks so much. Let's kick off this episode with you sharing a little bit about the work that you're doing now with Redline Equity.

00:53

Yeah, yeah. So a few years back, I guess I should back up more than a few years. So, about 14 years ago, I started becoming more and more interested in real estate investing. Started with a house hack, actually back in 2007. Nobody really called it that at that point, it was just hey, I had some extra room in my home. I was traveling about 50 weeks out of the year. So I was really never there. I was wasting space in my house. So let me put out an ad on Craigslist to my wife or my girlfriend at the time. Maybe fiancé I don't remember. was like That's kind of creepy. That's that's very strange. Why would you do that? Because it wasn't it wasn't really common at that point. But long story short, I found a good match with a gentleman who was in town during the week and out of town during the weekend. So we were kind of reverse schedules. From there, it escalated quickly, right? I got I got my interest in, you know how I could start building you know that building an empire by building one one brick at a time on the single family side. And at that point, thought I would just do that piece by piece. You know, fast forward about five, six years later got into the short term rental space here at the Jersey Shore. Had a lot of fun, still having fun with that piece. But it really wasn't getting me where I thought I'd be you know that that point in my career around real estate investing. So fast forward to 2020, my wife and I are on vacation in Fort Myers, Florida. And I stumbled across this thread on Bigger Pockets. Many listening may have heard of that site. And it's a small name of the game, where a local quote unquote multifamily commercial real estate syndicator had successfully raised money and closed several deals. I might Wow, it was a 60 to 63 page thread, I read through that thing nonstop, much to my wife's dismay during our vacation. I was hooked. From there, you know, I read every book I could get my hands on listen to dozens of podcasts, join a mastermind group. And then ultimately, you know, got into three different syndications as a general partner and a couple different as a limited partner. And from there, it's, you know, as they say, the story was built.

02:52

Right. Got it? Well, I'm very excited to talk to you today we're going to talk a little bit about acquisition, we're going to talk about improvements, management process for large scale apartment buildings. Like you know how you get there through with syndication deals and stuff like that. And, you know, I've asked Andrew to join me to share his wealth of knowledge that he's gained throughout his 14 plus plus plus years in real estate, and is a commercial experience. So we're gonna jump right in with the first question. So can you first explain to our listeners, you mentioned syndication? Can you explain just very briefly what a syndication actually is?

03:26

So I should probably, you know, admit, for most people, it sounds like such a overpowering, you know, word of like, well, it's really confusing. And it's really simple if you break it down. What syndication really is, is a number of like minded investors pooling their money together to buy a much larger asset than they could afford to buy on their own or wanting to buy on their own. So in essence, it opens a lot of doors that wouldn't be open to individual investors.

03:49

Okay, fair enough. So give me some of the pros and cons of syndicating, you know, deals or being involved in syndications versus just owning them outright to your for yourself.

04:00

Sure, sure. I love talking about this because I'm at heart, I'm a DIY guy, right? I love to get my hands into a project, I tear down walls, do kitchen bathroom renovations. And ultimately, if you got all the time in the world, and you want to, you want to build your empire brick by brick, you can very much explore this single family route. So again, very time consuming as you start to as like I've experienced the past and many others. I had a guy on my show yesterday talking about building his 9th and 10th Deal. As a single family investor, it becomes very time consuming. And another you know, kind of drawback of building the single family deal by deal is, even if you have a property manager, they're still relying on you to be the primary decision makers. You're still calling you're still out, you're still on the hook for the you know, that's whatever your threshold is $500, $1,000 decisions. That becomes very, very intensive over the course of time. Versus the multifamily commercial syndication space on the, if you start and get your foot in the door like I did as a passive investor. So you're literally just vetting a deal. You know, getting in with it with a with a sponsorship team, and providing capital. And you really just get down to a point where you get monthly updates on what's going on, you get quarterly distributions, or monthly distributions from cash flow the property. And it's literally just mailbox money, which is fantastic. And it's, I can't think of a better way for a busy working professional like myself, yourself, to get their foot in the door. And you may find that I really love doing this, I want to play an active role as a partner. That's fantastic. But what a great way to get your foot in the door becoming a passive investor. It's literally very, very minimal time commitment. It's just really a capital infusion upfront.

05:39

So when you invest in your syndications, are you strictly doing multifamily? Are you doing other types of commercial deals as well?

05:47

I am actuallyI am still I'm a big believer in kind of focus is key. So yeah, of course, it's easy to get your attention drawn into things like self storage, which is you know, very attractive. Car washes and things like that. I'm a big believer in single point of focus, really master that for a few years, and then start to expand into adjacent spaces, like other things I just mentioned, like self storage. But I'm a big believer in focus is key, and I really liked the multifamily asset class.

06:13

So what would you say to the people that say, you know, as a passive investor in a syndication I, I have an issue with the lack of control? Right? You know, because that's a real thing.

06:23

It is. And there's a we'll get into it. We didn't talk much about the cons, you got to be open about that with your investors. You know, one is, yes, you're trusting the team to make the decisions on your behalf. But I also see that as a pro, I don't want to be bogged down. If I'm a busy professional, I want to trust the team with making those decisions. So I don't have to be bogged down by doing that. So it's, for me, it's as much of a pro as it is a con, I will say a way to overcome that risk is to make sure that you thoroughly vet and ask the right questions of your sponsorship team to make sure you're investing with the right people. Because once that trust is established, it's not even on your mind anymore. So as long as you're doing your proper due diligence and knowing the right questions to ask. By the way, we've got a great blog on our site with 101 questions to ask for the detail oriented on our site. We'll come to that later. If you're wondering, what do I ask, and I've got some book recommendations for listeners too. So as long as you're vetting the right places, you're asking the right questions. You're good. And again, I see that as more just as much of a pro as it is a con for some people.

07:19

Oh, fantastic. That's, that's actually great. I'll definitely grab that information from you. So would you recommend somebody starting with a syndication? If they have maybe some limited funds to invest and don't really, they're not quite comfortable with what direction to go? Would you say syndication is definitely the way you'd recommend for your first investment opportunity?

07:38

Look, there's no one size fits all for everybody. So I always start with education. Like I have people coming to me all the time, all the ways coworkers, friends, neighbors, family members, would say, hey, is this is this the right for me, I'm like, only you can make that decision. But what my job is to educate you on the pros and cons of do's and don'ts. And some people you know, may want to be very they have 20, 30 hours a week to devote and they want to build, they want to be really hands on. Maybe it's not the right path for you. But what I'm trying to appeal to and just like my own profile as people that have, you know, they're working a full time job have cash they want to invest, they want to get out of the volatility, the stock market, they want to diversify in terms of not being so tax heavy at the end of the year. That's who we're really tailored to. So there's no one size fits all. But I think you owe it to yourself or to your listeners to explore as an opportunity. It's not It's definitely not the only option. It's a great option, but it's certainly not the only option for those listening.

08:33

Okay. So how do you get started investing in a syndication? And how quickly do you think somebody can anticipate scaling?

08:42

Absolutely. So you I'm assuming you referring to as a passive investor as a passive investor? Yes. Yeah. So I mentioned education, that's got to be number one. And number two is you got to find a team to invest with, right and they don't typically come and fall on your lap just by mere advertising on Facebook or LinkedIn. So networking is a huge component, either attending a local alternative investing event. Or, you know, some real estate focused event in your area is a great way to meet people online. Investing communities, on Facebook groups, or LinkedIn groups are a great way. Finding and looking for newsletters around commercial real estate investing is another way. There's so many different options. But networking and finding your way to the right team that you trust is a great first step.

09:28

Okay. And how much money would you suggest somebody needs to have a set aside to do their first syndication deal to do to do their first investment?

09:37

That's a great question. It's, it's usually the one of the first things I'm asked. People don't know, like, hey, does this require millions of dollars? Somewhere in the middle, and I think people see, you know, things like crowdsourcing out there, which causes some confusion, I'd say, on average, you know, it really depends on the size of deal on the operator, how much money they're raising and things like that. But I'd say on average, you know, 25-50,000 is about the the minimum entry point be upwards of, you know, million to 3 million depending on the size of the deal. Some people may be rolling over, we have investors that take, you know, 1031 exchanges from either businesses or single family homes in this market, they've capitalizing on one or roll it in. That's a conversation you definitely want to have with your sponsor teams, whoever you're vetting.

10:17

Okay, that was gonna actually be one of my next questions. So you can 1031 Exchange into one of these syndication deals.

10:25

Absolutely. And I will say the rules by each team will vary very much from deal to deal. So for sure, you want to have that conversation one on one, you want to just rely on a generic webform. Definitely have that conversation because it requires some tight coordination with the team, some careful planning, especially if you're infusing a larger amount of capital. You want to make sure we have that spot reserved for you. And we have all the logistics worked out. But yeah, it's been done will continue to be done. And it's a great way to defer taxes.

10:52

Now, I'm assuming that all deals are very different in their size and shape and how they function. But is there a general rule of thumb for the amount of time that somebody should expect their capital to be tied up in the syndication deal?

11:07

Yeah, one thing to look for is that the sponsoring team should be very clear about what their business plan is going to be. What the what the assumptions are behind that, whether it be an interest rates and exit rate cap and things like that. I'd say for our deals, generally, we're looking to exit in about three to five years. Some of which we've done recently, or much sooner than that, depending on where the economy and demand goes, it get could be longer than that. So on average, we've been ahead of our projections, but that doesn't guarantee anything in the future. But I'd say in general, a lot of the if you're looking at a value add property and nota long term hold, it's going to generally be in the three to five year timeframe. There's no hard and fast one. But that's that's what we've seen in the past.

11:46

So after that three to five year timeframe, I assume that the asset is then sold?

11:51

Yeah, so we have a couple of options. The most common and preferred option is we sell it. But if the market allows and interest rates are the right in the right place, a refi is a great option to cash out and return everybody's capital, but still keep equity in the property and still keep those distributions coming. That's actually the best case scenario is we can return everybody's money and still generate cash. That's That's our best option.

12:15

Okay. So tell me a little bit more about you are touching on the subject about your your questions, right for finding the best type of syndication deal for each investor. Tell me a little bit about that. And then you know about your books and stuff like that, that you're referring to? Because I agree with you education is really key.

12:32

It really is. It's never, the question should never be like, should I invest? Your first question shouldn’t be should I invest in a deal A or B? It should be it's, you know, just the right asset investment type for me? And then you get into the types of the sponsor team. Which I believe is the most important piece of a deal, right? What is their tracker? Just gonna give you some of the highlights. So we have an article out there, it's that goes into a lot more depth. But I look at you know, what is their track record? Have they gone full cycle on a deal? Have they closed successfully? How they handled and don't get me wrong, every project has some kind of hurdle you're overcoming. If people aren't being transparent by telling you everything went perfectly, so hey, tell me about a time when it didn't go perfectly. Tell me about when you're, you're delayed on renovations, or you had to deal with evictions. And how'd you guys overcome that? Like, tell me about your obstacles? And they open it on front about that? Right? You know, what do you know, what are the assumptions behind some of your business plan? Right? There's there's a couple of big levers that syndicators and operators will use to, I'll call juice up returns, right? One of which is playing your rent growth projections. They are a major factor and your assumptions behind my projected growth and my IRR and my average returns, right? So having a property manager vet those as I go into a deal is very, very important to us. We you know, we trust our instincts first, but that's only the start. Vetting it with a property manager getting you know, very, very tight comps, secret shopping properties. That's the kind of due diligence we're doing behind those rent assumptions. Another one is exit cap rate, right? That's a for those who aren't in the know. And we've got plenty of articles behind this as well. It's a measure of the demand for a type of property when you expect to exit it. Yeah. How much is somebody willing to pay for $1 of income in three to five years, you're making some assumptions there. Some are much more aggressive than others. We try to take the conservative approach whenever possible. And in fact, every case that makes sense for us or for our investors, so there are a couple of letters and there's a lot of other factors that go into it. But there are a couple that they're just kind of a preview into that blog I mentioned before. Okay, great.

14:32

The episode will continue in just a moment.

14:36

As an investor, we know it's important to stay on top of market trends and real estate opportunities that add value to your portfolio. We also know that having a trusted source of reliable information to help you stay a step ahead of other investors is critical to your success. If you're interested in having these types of resources, as well as access to me and my team, I invite you to join the Empire Investment Club. A free service that gives you an easier way to make sense of today's and tomorrow's real estate opportunities. As a member of the Empire Investment Club, you'll get access to relevant resources and investment focused experiences such as live interactive webinars, market trend presentations, and investor socials designed to equip you with what you need to succeed. So whether you're an active investor, passive investor, a combination of both or just starting out, the club is where you'll get what you need to build a portfolio you love. To join, just head over to JenniferdeJesus.com, sign up, and we'll see you in the club, where everyone's on a journey to becoming a better investor.

15:34

So, tell me about the actual deals that you are syndicating. Where are they located first of all?

15:40

Awesome. So we, I really like the southeast in general, we've we've started to diversify from there. But we're in Georgia, and South Carolina and Louisville, Kentucky. Currently really looking to expand into the southeast even more. So North Carolina, South Carolina, continuing to build in Georgia, and even the Midwest. But trying to really focus right now on the southeast. And we range from 43 units to 207 units. And we're just getting under contract now a new offering coming out about 300 unit portfolio in the Carolinas area.

16:10

Nice. I know, are you doing any kind of ground up construction? Or is it typically like redevelopment or value add place?

16:19

Right, currently, it's all value add. Again, I mentioned the focus piece, we're really drilling down that But one area that's really caught my attention, our team's attention is the built to rent space. So that that would be the next foray into development would be, you know, building a series of townhomes and single family homes in a community that we build with the intention of renting them and holding them for, let's say, a two to three year timeframe. It's very similar to a value add in terms of the business plan, just there's a lot, there's a lot more actually opportunity there. It's just not as known as an entity as value add. So it's something that we're exploring and starting to educate our investors on. And then we will you know, in the next couple of years, I expect lock up a few properties and deals in the in the builder to rent space.

17:01

Okay, so tell me about these value add plays, what are we what are we specifically doing to add value suggests rent increases? Is it a lot of distressed properties, where you're putting a lot of capital into the property to renovate it, little combination of both?

17:14

It can vary, right? So we've got you know, an asset in South Carolina and Greenville that we purchased, it was a newer asset 2006 build, and that one was a fairly light lift, I'll say. It was more just landscape, clean up some interior renovations repositioning a property, new signage, branding of it, and that resulted in $250 increase. Some of that was the economy some of that was a work we put in. We've got a property in Georgia, which is a heavier lifts, you know, all full roof replacements, full landscaping into your exteriors, parking lots, gating, signage, that was a much heavier lift. But in resulting has much heavier rent increases associated with as well. So I want the turn, I won't discriminate from you know, a light lift to a heavier value add. We've got experience across the board. And there's equal opportunity, sometimes more risk if you're assuming a higher rent projection with a heavier lift. But generally, you know, you plan accordingly, you plan for the right amount of Cap X you hedge for inflation and material costs, and you're good to go. But yeah, it can be across the board to answer your question. It can be a, you know, a newer B class asset we mentioned where it could just be you know, repositioning the property for a different type of tenant, cleaning it up a bit, hiring a new property manager all the way to a REIT. You know, we're kind of going guts, guts in rehab, and taking down walls and things like that. So it can vary.

18:29

So what are your biggest challenges today and in the economic state of the union today with acquiring the properties or even creating that value add?

18:39

So yeah, I guess I'll talk first about the acquisitions piece. You would think, you know, we're in late June 2022. Right now, the economy is quite volatile. Specifically, we're seeing a pretty big gap and in expectations and selling prices versus what people are willing to pay considering the cost of capital right now. So interest rates, if you guys listening known have grown substantially. And a lot of syndicators will leverage what we call bridge debt, or variable rate type of type of product. So with that comes wild fluctuations in interest rates, which can make your projections a little more challenging to capture, right. So we're seeing still very, very heavy demand for multifamily properties. So there's still a lot of competition. We are seeing some softening of prices right now and maybe softening expectations, but still very competitive. In fact, where we just put an offer in on properties are still seeing 14, 15, 20 bids in a secondary market in the US. So there's still I think what a lot of the volatility in the economy is still very, very strong demand. However, you just got to be a little more discriminatory in what you're projecting and your expectations and buying those rate caps or viewing a bridge rate product. Or in our case, we really liked fixed rate debt. Even if it is lower cash flow, it does secure that sense of you know, secureness, I guess for lack of a better term for our investors on the app ration side, the two biggest challenges are labor availability, and material costs, you know, no shock to those listening. But again, I think we need to be ultra conservative and maybe, you know, overly aggressive in material costs and going up in price. And just getting late, you know, labor availability and time, especially in secondary and tertiary markets, we might have to go 30 40 miles to find a good contractor. And, for example, the way we're underwriting that is maybe we'd normally assume 12 to 18 months to turn 80% of units, I might now put in 24 months, and add 25 to 50% to the material costs and labor costs to turn those interior units or exterior or whatever it may be. So again, we adjust accordingly. Usually, we might be overly conservative, but I'd rather be that way I'd rather under promise over deliver.

20:46

Right. And how are you trying to minimize the the challenges of the syndications with the current state? Like what are you doing to deal with the labor shortages and the material costs? Is there anything unique to the times now than maybe in the past that you're doing differently?

21:04

One thing we do in the last, I'd say three to four months, we're going through through due diligence. And as I mentioned, right now, as I will get, we will get hard and fast two or three quotes, and we'll go a little bit deeper and during the due diligence phase, and once as soon as we lock it up, we'll get people in there. In the past, you might get a rough figure for we that some of the bigger items. Now we're getting quotes for everything early in the project and sooner and just getting them to lock in for it. Yeah, they say 30 to 60 days with the expectation they would win the business, right. So we're doing that a little bit earlier than we normally would, which kind of locks into prep, we're still hedging on that adding, you know, maybe 10 20% to those figures, but we're doing that earlier in the process in DD than we would. So it's a lot more work earlier on, but it's it pays off with the risk being being mitigated.

21:51

Okay. And when when you're syndicating these deals, I assume that investors that are giving you capital for these syndications, I assume they know the deals that they're actually investing in upfront, right? We're syndicating specific deals? Or is there ever a time when they're giving you capital, but they don't actually know what they're being invested in?

22:08

So to date, we've done all deal by deal basis, right? So there's a lot of operators that will do a fund or a blind fund, we're saying, hey, here are the general types of assets we're going after, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's just I generally like you, I'm a control freak. Knowing exactly if I'm placing 50,000 or $100,000, I want to know who the team is, where the property is located what the schools or like, what the condition of the property is, and what the occupancy is? I want to know variable by variable. And if, if that's my standard, I want to make sure it's the same or higher for my investors. So that's just my way of operating. It's not the only way.

22:42

So how long has Redline Capital been around?

22:45

So we started operations in December 2019.

22:49

Okay, yeah. Has there ever been a time when you could not return somebody's capital?

22:53

Not yet. But not knock on wood? Again, there's a couple of assets that have not gone full cycle, but we're very, we're well ahead of pro forma projections in both properties. We've turned over most of the units in both scenarios. So very optimistic for the future, but you never know what the future holds.

23:09

So, yeah. Are you having any challenges actually finding the deals? Like currently, like, do you have more capital than you have deals right now? Or is it you're still able to balance it

23:19

No we're very much in the capital, we're pretty picky with properties too. A lot of our team members already have larger portfolios. So we're not in a rush to go buy anything by any means. I'd rather pass on 10 okay deals to find one or even 50. So none of us are really very picky. But we do have a lot of people. In fact, I got two email emails this morning from like, Hey, I haven't heard from you guys in a couple of weeks, like I've got this capital to place, particularly people who are getting nervous about stock market, I'd pull some cash out, or have some 1031 from cashed in on some fairly large gains, there's a sense of urgency to go buy something. But again, we can't let we can't be forced into making the wrong decision. So definitely in a position where deals are harder to find and capital right now. So it's a good place to be. But we just got to be very particular about, you know, be very scrutinizing all these things that come in.

24:10

So, yeah. So you talked about a little bit about the investor vetting the team that they're investing with to make sure that they're making the right decision? Yeah. How do you find the right investor for your syndications?

24:23

Yeah, it's a great question. We actually have a I think it's a 12 piece questionnaire that our Investor Relations Team, which is largely me right now. We'll go through and make sure it's the right fit. Like for instance, if someone's saving for their kids college, and they're expecting to go into a you know, starting tuition next year. And we have a three to five year hold period, right? Well, this has to this has to be a two way street, right? It has to be right for you. It has to be right for us. And if someone's gonna be freaking out and eight months, they can't get their capital back. Like that's this isn't the right fit, right? Because yeah, maybe we could exit that'd be fantastic if we could, but you can't count on that. So it's just as much as US vetting the investors to make sure it's right for them as This is something I want to be doing for 20 30 years. So this is not just one deal at a time and trying to build again back the Empire thing. This is a long term play. And we're in this for the investors for decades, not just for the next three to five years for one deal. So it's got to be a two way street. It's got to be right for them. It's got to be right for us.

25:17

Right they’re long term plays for retirement. They're not. They're not immediate needs of cash, right?

25:23

Correct. Correct? Yeah. Okay.

25:25

Yeah, yeah. So tell me a little bit about other markets that you're currently researching that you're not currently invested in?

25:36

Yeah, so I have a good couple of connections with partners in the Texas area. So specifically, Austin, San Antonio, DFW have got partners that are very active sending us deals, very much interested in those markets. But also very cautious of you know, the prices are a bit higher, the demand is also a bit higher. What I look for there is the population is growing, jobs are growing, incomes growing, you know, debt, still relatively very affordable across the country. So I really like that market. I liked the whole Sunbelt area actually, even parts of Kansas City, Missouri. We've we've got a lot of offers circulating in the last six months, in fact, over 100 million worth. in that market alone, I've got some common connections and partners there. So again, I like to focus on multifamily. But you got to be especially in times where things are very, very competitive, you got to have boots on the ground, and two or three or four different markets to kind of remain relevant. Really.

26:30

Right. So tell me about how you're how you're sourcing these deals. Are these like in these markets that you're in? Are they these like on market deals that the general consumer has access to? Or are they off market deals? How are you actually sourcing the deals right now,

26:44

It's actually a mix of both. So broker relationships is where it started. And you get so much deal flow for there. But what we found we actually launched in early May a direct seller campaign in the southeast. So we start with a list, we you know, we have a team of VAs that works for us full time, and we're constantly sending out hundreds of lead generations to direct to the seller each week. So it's combination of both for us. I feel like that's the only way to roll these days.

27:10

Yeah, you gotta have all your irons in the fire for sure. It's definitely not a one trick pony. That's right. So how does how do you feel syndications turn better returns in a real estate as a whole? What are the key factors that allow these returns to be so good for people?

27:29

Yeah, so it really comes down to the business plan and executing on the business plan. So, you know, if you compare it, let's say to the stock market, historically, you're looking at so assuming the taking the recent volatility of the equation, long term average 7-8%, S&P 500 or dollar index. Whereas we're looking at, you know, at minimum double digit returns. Assuming everything is legitimate in the business plan, assuming all your assumptions check out, etc. But it really comes down to can, is number one is is the business plan. Realistic, right? Like I talked about rent growth assumptions, talk about exit cap assumptions, talk about expense assumptions, and what's going to happen there, especially in recent times of inflationary things going on with material costs and labor. But and then can the team execute on it? Do they have the discipline? Do they have the track record of proving out what they projected has come to fruition? So it really comes down to that. Okay?

28:21

Are there additional tax advantages to doing syndications over just owning the assets outright yourself?

28:27

So it's funny, one of the original frustrating things to me as a you know, full time W2 executive was the amount of taxes you get crushed with at the end of the year. And I was like, Oh, my God, there's got to be a better way. Absolutely, yes. So a couple a couple of really key things there. One is paying capital gains versus ordinary income. Much, much lower percentage for most working professionals. Second is depreciation is a beautiful thing. So at the end of the year, you know, a typical investor will, take a couple of our examples in recent times, we're paying quarterly distributions at the end of the year, they're paying and years one and two, very little to nothing on that, on that source of income. So if you're looking to augment your job, ultimately replace your source of income or retire either early or on time. It's a fantastic way from a tax standpoint, for the reasons I just mentioned.

29:17

Okay, great. What didn’t I ask you that I should have?

29:23

So I can we come back to the education thing and I think you actually mentioned what are a couple of great recommendations. Yes, I'm a big book guy. Everybody learns different ways. I like a book called The Hands Off Investor by Brian Burke. And it takes you from the mindset of a passive investor but even if you're thinking about going on the active side, it runs you through all those questions we talked about asking so hats off the Brian has done a great job with that book. I think that would that's a almost could be a textbook for for those wanting to know what don't I know and where should I start? And second is we've got over 50 blogs on our site/ We release new one Is every week released podcasts every other week. Great sorts of education on our sites invest with redline.com. Email me, you know, sorts of the material, it's all free, no obligation, just go there and get your hands dirty.

30:12

Very good. So if I had to ask you, what is the number one thing you would tell people to absolutely not do? Ever in investing? Like, it's you're bound to fail? What would it be?

30:23

Don't jump into a deal or any type of offering without doing your due diligence, and I'm probably more on the extreme end. But I'd say you know, once you get the idea in your head, definitely take action, learn. But give yourself you know, at least 30 days to make sure hey, this is the right this is the right investment for me. This is the right team for me.

30:41

I also a second I second that as well. I would say the same thing if I was asked the same question, but I would also say, don't take advice from people that are not already doing it.

30:51

That's another fair point. You kind of make that assumption in your head. Yeah, people are doing that. But it's a very fair point to call that out. Because, yeah, many you know, lots of people advertising out there as hey, this is great. Check out syndication, but like, what are they done? What's their track record? They partnering with the right people? Do they have the experience, etc? You get it.

31:11

Very good. Well, I Andrew, I can't thank you enough. I think you are an incredible wealth of knowledge. You've given our listeners an incredible amount of resources to look into. And I think, you know, as I said, education is really key. So again, I can't thank you enough. You're absolutely fantastic. And you know, I hope our listeners will definitely reach out and learn a little bit more about Redline Equity.

31:33

I really appreciate that. Thanks for having me on the show. It's really great to share my passion with everyone.

31:38

Awesome. Thank you so much. Thank you for listening to today's episode with Andrew Schutsky from Redline Equity. You can check out all his information on our show notes page and until next time, take care.

31:52

For more information about how Jennifer can help you plan, develop and manage a strong real estate investment portfolio visit growingempires.com